Please help me with this (rosacea at nose)

[Bonefish]

I decided to put my pictures here, because "picture tell more than thousand words" :) Im 18 and I've had this rosacea on my nose now about 4 years (im really starting to doubt is this even rosacea because all the other rosaceapictures i've seen doesn't look like this :o). I've tryed already tetracyclines (3 months), metrogel and some natural products but for those metrogel seems to be only thing which cleared up little bit that upper rosacea-area. Now I am currently taking accutane 20 mg/day and im on second month, but I really can't see difference yet :cry: Besides that redness there is lot of sebum inside there. Accutane seems to stopped production of sebum from everywhere else but not at nose :?

Here are the pictures (you really cant see whole thruth for these pictures)

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/11.9.2005.jpg
11.9.2005 (still some summer tanning)

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/8.1.2006.jpg
8.1.2006 (I sniff my nose that the redness would show up)

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/29.1.2006.jpg
29.1.2006

All those triggers gets my nose annoyingly red and it starts to swell. After all my nose looks in any case bigger than it would normally look. Anyone has had same kind of nose or symptoms and got rid of it? Please tell me how. Could I get to surgery for this, because im really already thinking about it. Please help! :cry:

[IowaDavid]

The redness and enlarged pores does look like the beginning of phymatous rosacea....but this started when you were 14? Your nose responds to "typical" rosacea triggers by getting red?

20mg accutane/day sounds a bit high for a low-dose treatment course--it may be slowly promoting redness at that dosage. Whatever may be your optimal dose, it can take some people several months to see results from low-dose accutane, so don't be discouraged just yet.

I don't know too much about low-dose accutane, but there are others on this site that have posted about it. Also, you can search the rosacea-support archives Here. (http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/rosacea-support/messages)

Another option is to go see an IPL doctor and get a test-patch done on your nose--if it's localized right now, treatments for just your nose shouldn't cost too much.

Of course, DON'T get IPL treatments while you're taking accutane because accutane tends to slow wound-healing.

[Bonefish]

Thank you David. Ok, ill talk to my dermatologist about that lower accutanedose and possible IPL treatment if this accutane regiment wont work.

I got this about age 14. And yes, my nose responds those triggers by getting red and also those pores get bigger (I think) which make my nose look even more ugly :( I really hope that this is not going to be that phymatous nose. Although my father got rosacea and only rosacea at nose area also.

I would like to hear if anyone has had same kind of "noseproblem" and got rid of it because this is really destroying my life :(

[Bob Bear]

Id go see a good doc, try to get an official diagnosis.

Also, try Dr Nase's book. Full of easy to digest info about rosacea of all flavors.

BB

[Bonefish]

I tryed to find out what laser would be the right one at my nose but couldn't (bad english :?). There are so many lasers.. What laser would you reccomendate? Maybe some kind of "surgic" laser to "destroy" this rosacea? Is this YAG-laser that kind of surgic laser? Of course im going to speak about this with my dermatologist.

[redhotoz]

Hi Bonefish

I don't know a lot about Accutane or lasers. Haven't gone down that path yet. One thing that I have noted from the people who have posted about Accutane is that it has not helped so much with the nose area. Of course, this is different for everyone, but I have noticed quite a few posts like that, when other people also have Rosacea on the rest of their face. That is, Accutane helped with the main part of the face and not so much with the nose.

I don't mean to be pessimistic but it may be worth considering. As IowaDavid suggested, do a search in the archives of the RSG or here in the Forum to see what others have had to say about Accutane and the nose. Maybe something like "Accutane nose" as the key words?

Best of luck!

Jen

[adyus]

Hi Bonefish

I don't know a lot about Accutane or lasers. Haven't gone down that path yet. One thing that I have noted from the people who have posted about Accutane is that it has not helped so much with the nose area. Of course, this is different for everyone, but I have noticed quite a few posts like that, when other people also have Rosacea on the rest of their face. That is, Accutane helped with the main part of the face and not so much with the nose.

I don't mean to be pessimistic but it may be worth considering. As IowaDavid suggested, do a search in the archives of the RSG or here in the Forum to see what others have had to say about Accutane and the nose. Maybe something like "Accutane nose" as the key words?

Best of luck!

Jen

Actually, I know that accutane is among the few options for rhinophyma.

A quick google search for "rhinophyma" and "accutane" will get alot of search results. For example:
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/001037.htm

Bonefish, you should also search this forum and the R-S yahoo group for factual cases of accutane used for rhinophyma. Like Jen said, good search terms are "accutane" and "nose".

I have saved some articles and posts on another computer, send me a PM if you want me to mail them to you.

Best wishes,

Adrian

[Lisa M]

Hi B, after 3.5 weeks of Accutane 10 mg/day, my nose was 75% back to normal.

Do it. It's like nothing else.

Just don't let your dermatologist mess around wi/dosage.
You'll be able to get a sense of what's working for people under the Accutane thread.

[Bonefish]

Thank you all lot of your answers. For Lisa M, maybe you didn't notice but I mentioned at my starting post that im already taking accutane. :) I've been accutane exactly 2 months now but I can't see any difference. :( Was your nose looking same as mine? How long you had that rosacea at nose before starting accutane? And did you use any other products while taking accutane? That 3,5 weeks (or months?) is really amazing time for healing so much. But congratulations for you anyway :)

I found lots of posts of those using accutane also at nose area and most of them were taking low-dose. It's hard to believe that it would work, because at this 20mg/day -dose, I haven't see any difference. If that low-dose (5-10 mg?) would work, I would believe that this dose would show even a little bit signs of healing. But no.. Im considering that anyway.

I don't think my derm can help me much at this decision because he seems like really unprofessional at rosacea-patients. At first visit many months ago, he ordered me cortisone! Maybe because that sebum..

Maybe this is not rosacea but some kind of pre-stage rhinophyma... dont know.. But im really starting to think that some kind of surgic operation (laser) is going to be my only change :(

[adyus]

I found lots of posts of those using accutane also at nose area and most of them were taking low-dose. It's hard to believe that it would work, because at this 20mg/day -dose, I haven't see any difference. If that low-dose (5-10 mg?) would work, I would believe that this dose would show even a little bit signs of healing. But no.. Im considering that anyway.


To make an analogy: When you have a flu and you take antibiotics, you take 500mg/day for 10 days for example. If you were to take 5000 mg in just one day, that would be very messy. It's not a perfect analogy, but you see the point.

From what I understand, the idea behind accutane for rosacea treatment is to take it low-dose for a long period of time. Some doctors started testing and they saw that low dose yielded the best results, and the high dosage used for acne made some people worse than before. I guess that is what happenned.

If I were you, I would lower my dosage and see what happens. You haven't anything to lose. I think you'll find in that archive, text abstracts from clinical trials regarding low dose accutane. You could show them to your doctor. Like I said in the PM, I'll send it tomorrow.

Best wishes,

Adrian

[lakan]

considering the surgery one can do to fix the nose due to rhinophyma, can you do this at any point or does the nose have to grow very big before docs can do anything about it?

[smudge]

Why does accutane seem to be working for everyone except for me? Im just sick by this!

Doing well on 20mgs daily and then facial lesions reappeared! What the hell?

any ideas why mine could be more stubborn?

-liz

[Bonefish]

For smudge: I really dont know but seems like we are kind a same boat :? I read that whole accutane thread and noticed that you've been at 10mg/day also. How long and what dosages have you taken now?

But in any case now I decidet to start 20/mg everyother day. Yesterday I called to my derm and talked about this low-dose and lasers. We didn't talk about time I have to take this, but he just said that "we've been giving accutane to our patients ½ year and id needed then 1 year" :o Isn't 20/mg everyother day for next 10 months bit too much IF im really taking it that long (I dont really want to take it that long!) ? He also said that if this won't work, then we are going to use lasers (which im waiting much more than taking accutane MAYBE next 10 months erhm :roll:)

[smudge]

hi bonefish!!! I know how frustrating all of this is. I had a relapse around the holidays and my rosacea got much worse with breakouts so my derm has been upping my dosage every month.... last monday she wanted me to up it to 60mgs daily! my skin and nose kept getting worse, so im bringing the dosage back down to 20mgs daily.

I wish i had gone for laser instead of doing accutane 'cause who knows when i will be able to go at this rate?

have a good day!

liz

[Kelli]

Smudge - You sound like you'd do better on the MUCH lower dosages that have been discussed. Too much of a good thing isn't always a good thing for everyone!

I personally have a low tolerance for medications, except when it comes to things like novocaine. An aspirin has more of an affect on me than a shot of numbing juice.

I guess what I'm getting at is that Accutane may work for you, but at very small percentages. Have you tried doing the 10mg everyother day routine I've read about here? I still think your Dr. was on crack prescribing you 60mg!!!

[slippy]

Hey mate.

My nose was like yours then I found our about V-Beam Pulse Dye laser and my nose went back to normal.

You'll get heavy bruising which will last about 2-3 weeks but after that you'll be back to normal colour skin on your nose.

I think you cant do the laser whilst on accutane though so I guess you'll have to suffer it until you finish your tablets.

[drummond]

I decided to put my pictures here, because "picture tell more than thousand words" :) Im 18 and I've had this rosacea on my nose now about 4 years (im really starting to doubt is this even rosacea because all the other rosaceapictures i've seen doesn't look like this :o). I've tryed already tetracyclines (3 months), metrogel and some natural products but for those metrogel seems to be only thing which cleared up little bit that upper rosacea-area. Now I am currently taking accutane 20 mg/day and im on second month, but I really can't see difference yet :cry: Besides that redness there is lot of sebum inside there. Accutane seems to stopped production of sebum from everywhere else but not at nose :?

Here are the pictures (you really cant see whole thruth for these pictures)

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/11.9.2005.jpg
11.9.2005 (still some summer tanning)

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/8.1.2006.jpg
8.1.2006 (I sniff my nose that the redness would show up)

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/29.1.2006.jpg
29.1.2006

All those triggers gets my nose annoyingly red and it starts to swell. After all my nose looks in any case bigger than it would normally look. Anyone has had same kind of nose or symptoms and got rid of it? Please tell me how. Could I get to surgery for this, because im really already thinking about it. Please help! :cry: just out of interest can you tell me what is the skin like on the area just and above the cuticules of all your fingers for example is it smooth and shiny bit red or is it pale soft and looks like normal skin. and do you know if you sweat from this point on your fingers. drummond

[Callien]

Back in January Geoffrey posted this. I guess it's supposed to help with nose swelling. It is also recommended to take low dose Accutane (5-10mg per day) for 18-24 months and use a maintenance dose after that if needed (10mgs 3x per week).

I'm not sure about this but you might want to lower your Accutane dose because 10mgs is supposed to be better than 20. Higher doses actually make rosacea worse. I think it takes a while for Accutane to kick in when in comes to nose swelling but Geoffrey also recommends Ketotifen as listed below. Not sure about the dose but an Internet search should help answer that.

I don't think anyone on this board has tried this so if you do let us know how it works for you. Good luck!

Ketotifen does very little by itself.

When added to accutane it affects the lymphatics and increases drainage which knocks out the swelling. When you talk to your doctor, just make sure you keep it low dose. It moves the swelling around for a while until you find a lymphatic drainage area. So, you may have odd bouts of swelling untiil it starts to kick in.

[Bonefish]

just out of interest can you tell me what is the skin like on the area just and above the cuticules of all your fingers for example is it smooth and shiny bit red or is it pale soft and looks like normal skin. and do you know if you sweat from this point on your fingers. drummond
There are so many difficult words so im not sure did I understood everything. But the above cuticles is smooth and soft yes. And when I try to squish softly tip of my nose, it feels like there is some kind of soft pumb(?) inside. I really can't understand meaning of these adjectives.. :?

I hate that my vision has gone worse (even dayvision I think :(), I have to use that damn grease all the time to my lips, hands and mucouses of my nose, and most of all I hate this &¤&#$@# waiting! It would be more ok to wait if I would see EVEN small progress of healing. But no. Redness and size of my nose hasn't been changed even a bit of that day one I started taking accutane. I really hate using accutane and im thinking that in atleast this kind of cases lasertreatments should be the choice before accutane. One thing im waiting is that inner metrodiazole. Metrogel 75% shrinks the size of my nose little bit and fades the redness bit at that upper rosacea-area. Does anyone know when it is ready and available here in Europe?

And Callen, what you proposed me to try is really for someone more patient than me. This disease effects really much at my everyday social life and destroys it. :( and im not going to take that risk that I try that method 18-25 months and then it wont work :( I think im going to take accutane month or two and then ask if I can get to lasertreatment.

[drummond]

I decided to put my pictures here, because "picture tell more than thousand words" :) Im 18 and I've had this rosacea on my nose now about 4 years (im really starting to doubt is this even rosacea because all the other rosaceapictures i've seen doesn't look like this :o). I've tryed already tetracyclines (3 months), metrogel and some natural products but for those metrogel seems to be only thing which cleared up little bit that upper rosacea-area. Now I am currently taking accutane 20 mg/day and im on second month, but I really can't see difference yet :cry: Besides that redness there is lot of sebum inside there. Accutane seems to stopped production of sebum from everywhere else but not at nose :?

Here are the pictures (you really cant see whole thruth for these pictures)

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/11.9.2005.jpg
11.9.2005 (still some summer tanning)

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/8.1.2006.jpg
8.1.2006 (I sniff my nose that the redness would show up)

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/29.1.2006.jpg
29.1.2006

All those triggers gets my nose annoyingly red and it starts to swell. After all my nose looks in any case bigger than it would normally look. Anyone has had same kind of nose or symptoms and got rid of it? Please tell me how. Could I get to surgery for this, because im really already thinking about it. Please help! :cry:;; dear bonefish i fancy having a go at fixing your nose i have an experimental guy fawks gunpowder plan that might just fix it should you be interested no cost involved. i feel that i must mention that as far as i understand laser treatments are destructive to the natural blood supply of the nose and irreversable and will prevent any hope of natural healing for you in the future

[Mats]

Bonefish 3 month is just the start give it time low dose is the go.
Laser is the last you should try as drummond saying.

[Bonefish]

Thank you all for your support. Well, I'll stick with this accutane.. :( But how long is the minimum time? I just feel like im wasting my youth with this and soon im going to be an old man and still having this disgusting red nose... And soon is again one wasted summer, sunshine and im afraid that it's going to effect somehow that accutane wont do the job because sun makes this worse.. And I dont want to avoid sun and swimming and all the great stuff at whole summer...

Little offtopic, but sebum prduction seems to stopped from everywhere but nose. I wrote about ultrasound at that other thread, and was just wondering could that be the solution to suck that sebum off, that nose could start "healing" and become normal? Just thought that maybe that sebum somehow "feeds" the inflametation..

[Bonefish]

Would it be same to take rinomar as take ketotifen?

[drummond]

Would it be same to take rinomar as take ketotifen? dear Bonefish i have posted this following post in another section.
this is a method that i think may be of particular interest to you as i feel it could be a way to fix your nose but as you are on accutane at the moment i think you should see the accutane treatment through and see if it helps.

meanwhile here is my guy fawks sweating system that i posted it may give you something to think about during the future comming weeks;;;;;;;;;;;;;guy fawks gunpowder sweating system. eat breakfast miss dinner have tea at no later than 6pm. teatime meal can be mild to medium curry and boiled rice or mashed potato or any carbohdrate like say pasta but it must be carbohydrate and not fried or roasted like say chips etc. or the meal can be rice with skewered sliced grilled chicken, "marinate chicken in tai tom yum sauce" add one heaped teaspoon to half a cup of water mix and pour over two chicken breasts to marinate for six hours skewer up and grill chicken to no more than 75 degrees centi, serve on a bed of rice .
do not drink any alcohol on the day only water and do not eat anything afterwards . if you must eat, four ginger biscuits and a cup of hot water is acceptable no later than 8 p. m go to bed around ten pm. in the morning when the swung/flush sweating feeling comes and you feel like sweating get yourself under the bed covers keep as hot as you can and be patient and be concious that you want to sweat.
stay under the covers for ideally one hour but a minimum of thirty minutes and BOY you should sweat. obviously as redhotz suggested it should be without question that by now all you rosaceans should be fully hydrated before "you go for it".
after this guy fawks treatment your face will be very red and spotty, the spots are nothing but your sebaceous glands that have got fired up and i belive this is a positive step. the next day the redness usually subsides. there is no added benifit from eating an extreemly hot curry.
after the sweat its normal to shower but do avoid washing your face. care must be taken not to eat too much chilli spiced foods as they can affect your stomach lining and maybe other vital organs especially if chilli is not part of your indiginous diet.
here is a tip::: do extra pieces of chicken and wrap two pieces each in tin foil and freeze, each night or alternate eat two pieces of tom yum chicken witha glass of water three hours before going to bed if you want just to have a slighter sweat. i wish to make it understood that i am not responsible for any greivances arising out of trying this guy fawks treatment if you do, you do it at your own risk. drummond

[Bonefish]

I tryed to get ketotifen but found out that it is not here in Finland. I found only some ketotifen -named eyedrops.. Could someone please tell me if it is at other name here in Europe. And if not then could someone post a link where I could order that.

And drummond, I must use my transalation book a lot at sometime to transfer that "treatment" text :) Seems a bit weird but maybe worth to try.

[drummond]

I tryed to get ketotifen but found out that it is not here in Finland. I found only some ketotifen -named eyedrops.. Could someone please tell me if it is at other name here in Europe. And if not then could someone post a link where I could order that.

And drummond, I must use my transalation book a lot at sometime to transfer that "treatment" text :) Seems a bit weird but maybe worth to try.Hey bonefish i have some good news for you today. I have had a small patch of red on the top of my head that flairs up now and again. the cause is when the sebaceous glands in that area will not open so the sweat becomes trapped causing redness and a few spots yes.
so what i did was as an experiment i applied the GUY FAWKS SWEATING SYSTEM. BUT I ADDED LITTLE EXTRA TOBASCO SAUCE. WHAT HAPPENS WHEN I WAS SWEATING IN THE MORNING THE HEAT FROM THE CHILLI PEPPER IN THE MIXTURE BURST OPEN THE SEBACEOUS GLAND OF THE RED AREA.
THEN IT BLISTERED AND WENT SPOTTY SO IT LOOKS REALLY BAD THEN I LEFT IT TO HEAL I NEVER TOUCHED IT WITH MY FINGERS. NOW FOUR WEEKS LATER IT HAS HEALED UP SO WONDERFULL AND NOW WHEN I SWEAT .
THE SWEAT COMES OUT OF THAT NEW PART SO I HAVE GOT MY SEBACEOUS GLANDS WORKING AGAIN IN THAT PART. AND THE SKIN IS VERY NORMAL NOW. I BELIVE THE SAME PROCESS WOULD CURE YOUR NOSE, IT MAY TAKE HAVE TO DO IT TWO TIMES.
SAY IF YOU WISH I MAY TRY TO FIND SOMEONE TO SPEAK YOU LANGUAGE( I KNOW SOMEONE THAT SPEAKS SWEDISH ?) IF YOU REALLY WOULD LIKE TO TRY THE "GUY FAWKS"
YES MY IDEAS ARE WEIRD BECAUSE THEY ARE A TOTALLY OPPOSITE BELIVE TO THE NORMAL ROSACEA BELIVE.
ONE OF MY BELIVES IS THAT IT IS EXTREEMLY VITAL TO SWEAT FROM THE SORE/RED PART OF YOUR NOSE SKIN.
ALSO FLUSHING IS GOOD IF YOU TAKE IT TO THE NEXT LEVEL WHICH IS SWEATING.
BUT MY METHODS DO WORK AND I CAN PROOVE THAT THEY DO WORK. AND THEY DON,T COST HARDLY ANY MONEY. MAYBE FIND OUT IF YOU CAN BUY:
"TOM YUM SAUCE" WE BUY IT HERE FROM CHINEESE STORE OR TAIWANEESE STORE. DRUMMOND

[Bonefish]

Ok, little update. I've been now on accutane 10mg/day (as you see at my signature) and my nose is still EXCACTLY same looking as it was 3 months ago.

Anyway my derm said that I must take accutane as far as summer. Then he said that im going to take an accutane break and when summer is over we are going to try laser. I suggested him that if I could try that oral metronidazole at summer and he said it is ok (metrogel has shrinken my nose a bit). But before that im going to try that drummonds suggestion. I might try that even before summer because im feeling that this accutane by it self wont do nothing (I really want that ketotifen :roll:) So im little bit thinking about stopping accutane. I dont believe that some inmiricle is going to happen lets say like month six because not even little change has happened so far.

I cant get ketotifen in any way here in Finland but I found this page: http://www.npmeds.com/fda/online/Ketotifen.shtml
So is that 28,80$ package the right one? And are those in tablet form and not the damn eyedrops? And what would be the total cost (delivery etc.). Althought they say that shipping is free so does this mean that I have to pay only that 28,80$ then? And what do you guys think is this reliable? Too bad I my english is so bad.. Someone please answer at those questions I really need to know. And if this is not the right one then please link me a page where I can order those.

One more question for drummond: Why cant I do that while taking accutane? Because althought my nose is still full of sebum even I've been on accutane. Is that sebum somehow in different form or what?

Edit: I've found out that my nose is always more swollen at morning then at evening. If it would be as "not swollen" as it is at evening, the maybe there would happen some clearing. But at morning it is always like starting again. How could I keep my nose "clear" over night? I change my pillow blanket every other day..

[drummond]

Ok, little update. I've been now on accutane 10mg/day (as you see at my signature) and my nose is still EXCACTLY same looking as it was 3 months ago.

Anyway my derm said that I must take accutane as far as summer. Then he said that im going to take an accutane break and when summer is over we are going to try laser. I suggested him that if I could try that oral metronidazole at summer and he said it is ok (metrogel has shrinken my nose a bit). But before that im going to try that drummonds suggestion. I might try that even before summer because im feeling that this accutane by it self wont do nothing (I really want that ketotifen :roll:) So im little bit thinking about stopping accutane. I dont believe that some inmiricle is going to happen lets say like month six because not even little change has happened so far.

I cant get ketotifen in any way here in Finland but I found this page: http://www.npmeds.com/fda/online/Ketotifen.shtml
So is that 28,80$ package the right one? And are those in tablet form and not the damn eyedrops? And what would be the total cost (delivery etc.). Althought they say that shipping is free so does this mean that I have to pay only that 28,80$ then? And what do you guys think is this reliable? Too bad I my english is so bad.. Someone please answer at those questions I really need to know. And if this is not the right one then please link me a page where I can order those.

One more question for drummond: Why cant I do that while taking accutane? Because althought my nose is still full of sebum even I've been on accutane. Is that sebum somehow in different form or what?

Edit: I've found out that my nose is always more swollen at morning then at evening. If it would be as "not swollen" as it is at evening, the maybe there would happen some clearing. But at morning it is always like starting again. How could I keep my nose "clear" over night? I change my pillow blankOne more question for drummond: Why cant I do that while taking accutane? Because althought my nose is still full of sebum even I've been on accutane.

:: There is nothing to stop you doing the guy fawks while you are on accutane ,when I said before it was because it was only for the reason to give the accutane a “best” “chance” try. Also how will you know if it was the accutane or the guy fawks that fixed you nose. and your derm would not be very pleased to know that you were trying something else at the same time. Because if the accutane did not work he would blame Drummonds guy fawks.

Is that sebum somehow in different form or what? NO! it is just that it is trapped inside wanting to escape but because your sebaceous glands are inflamed they don’t let it out. The sebaceous glands cannot make the beforesweat liquid into sweat. SWEAT IS FORMED AT THE PRECISE MOMENT AS LIQUID FROM THE BODY PASSES THROUGH THE SEBACEOUS GLAND. WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO IS TO BURST OPEN THE INFLAMMED SEBACEOUS GLANDS USING THE GUY FAWKS AND SWEATING. AFTER YOU HAVE BURST OPEN THEM YOU NOSE WILL LOOK REALLY BAD/WORSE. BUT AS LONG AS YOU DO NOT PICK THE SPOTS THEY WILL HEAL OVER MAYBE FIVE WEEKS . THEN THEY WILL BE REPAIRED THEN AFTER JUST KEEP SWEATING FROM YOU NOSE TO MAKE SURE THE DON’T BECOME BLOCKED UP AGAIN. I SWEAT VERY GOOD FOR 30 MIN EVERY MORNING BEFORE I GET OUT OF BED.
Edit: I've found out that my nose is always more swollen at morning then at evening. If it would be as "not swollen" as it is at evening, the maybe there would happen some clearing. But at morning it is always like starting again. How could I keep my nose "clear" over night? I change my pillow blanket every other day.
Bonefish I can understand the difficulty and frustration with your nose but until you can get the sebum outside into the open air your nose will never get better, so at the moment trying to keep your nose clear less red is not helping, by now if the accutane was working your nose should be much redder.
You must understand that it has to get much bad before it gets much better . This bad is start of the healing process and you have to prepare yourselves for this to happening. Your nose is more swollen in the morning because that is the time when everybody is sweating, before when your nose was very well you would be sweating but you would not be conscious/ aware of that happening.
I said earlier that part of my head was like your nose so I did the guy fawks, now five weeks later it has healed and I can sweat from that part now. It looked quite bad like sun burn blister during that time but now it looks good.
CONCERNING LASER TREATMENT: I myself belive that a derm is not the person to be treating your nose . my opinion is that derms do a lot more bad to people skin that cannot never ever be made good and I would not have laser treatment because that will cause more problems later. DERMS IN MY OPINION WILL TAKE YOUR MONEY AND AT THE SAME TIME MAKE IT WORSE SO THEN YOU HAVE TO KEEP GOING FOR MORE TREATMENT.IF THEY WERE ANY HELP YOU WOULD BE BETTER BY NOW. I POSTED IN THE THEORY CAUSE AND CURE HOW BAD A DERM HAD DONE TO A MEMBER OF MY FAMILY AND OTHER PEOPLE I KNOW. THE TREATMENT DID NOT MAKE IT BETTER Drummond
..[/quote]
::

[Bonefish]

Ok, little update and some pictures of lasertreatment. I went to laser at 7.6.2006 and these both pictures were taken at today 14.6.2006 one week after laser.

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/bruise1.jpg
(normal bulb light and little swetting)

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/Bruise2.jpg
(normal day light, also little swetting on skin)

Im not even yet sure what is the name of that laser he used. Im really not sure but I think it was that vbeam(?), because he said that it burns/burned blood vessels and because of that, reduces that redness at my nose. And I also got those brusies what slippy said in his post.. The doctor said that I suppost to go there again in my second lasertreatment after those bruises have vanished. I think it takes little longer because my skin broke pretty badly at the tip and now there is a scab (what you can see at the pictures). He said that this takes 2 treatments that the laser gets in at the "deeper" blood vessels also and that the redness would go aways as much as possible. So I really hope that after that second treatment my nose is all the way in normal colour..

Allthought this is really sad that I have to avoid the sunlight (I have even summer holiday) now and use cab all the time because the more brown-coloured my skin is, the worster the laser gets in at blood vessels doctor said.. Anyone know could I put just normal plaster at my nose to cover it from sunshine or would that just be bad..

I also asked him that how I could get the size of my nose smaller. He said that the accutane is the best for my by that (he didnt say that it surely will help), but I really dont want to start that again. In that 4+ months it didnt do even a little change and I dont really want that again :(

He said that he also uses some micropeel laser (not sure about the word), but because of my young age (I think) he didnt like the idea of using that because there is a change of scarring and unnormal colour of my nose if he would use that. He also said that the surgery would be the better option then micropeel laser if I would really go in that way. Then I looked the prices and it was something like 4000-5000 euros... Well, that is really the last change then.. So far, metrogel 0.75% has been the only thing which has downsized my nose but only a little.. So if someone have done the micropeel in at nose or else place, please tell me did you get scarring or some un-natural colour in your skin, or is it even really that big change and why would anyone take that then? I might be ready to take that risk even then...

But he said that these 2 treatments would do the job and effect so that I may be happy with the result of those. I really hope that too but lets see...

(edit: the pictures may just lie a little for the size of my nose, but I dont want to put my whole faces in internet)

[Bonefish]

I'll update my situtaion once again I hope you read my sad story.. Well as I scared the CO2-lasertreatment didn't do much of a nothing then lighted up my wollet :(

Here is the picture taken next day after the lasertreatment. The new skin in this picture hasen't yet make it to grow under so it looks pretty discusting.

http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/CO1.jpg

Well the time went by, and my new skin peeled under the cover after about 1-2 weeks.. I really avaited that moment to see my "new nose" but what a dissapointment it was when nothing had happened. first when skin started to peel and I soo the new skin under, it looked a bit more normal then red, but then rosacea took control again I think and when it had peel completely, the same reddness and swollowness was back again and my nose was redder then ever.

Ok, time went by and I was sad, thinking that my only opinions were to eat accutane a long time or to use drummonds swetting system. I decided to await a little that the reddness and swollowness which that lasertreatment caused, would go away a little bit.

And yesterday (now is 16:th on december), after speaking pretty lot with drummond in MSN mesenger by using microphones, I started the swetting system. There are still some things that I need to know about that but we will figure those out.

Also as I thought and scared, I started today also eating accutane once again ( :( ) because I really have no choice, and I also use rozex gel 2xday. And both of these (and swetting system) I think im going to do a loong time... :cry:

This is really sad, what I have noticed is that the rosacea has started to move more up in my nose. I soo that the "rosacea tissue" started to move more up even before I went that laser, and I really think that it is not because of laser why it has started to spread. In my dad's nose the rosacea has covered the whole nose, except sides, which seems to happen me too now when I get older :(

So here you can see how it has started to spread

Picture taken now (16.12.2006)
http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/16.12.2006.jpg

And picture taken about 10 months ago (27.3.2006)
http://personal.inet.fi/clan/bonefish/27.3.2006.jpg
The picture resolution is different but you can see something.... :(

I would have few questions for you about accutane. I thought about taking it 1 year or longer on 10mg dose /day, BUT we talked about it with my dermatogist, but he said that if want the SAME result in faster time, then I should just take it like 40mg/day one month and then 20mg/day as far as needed. I tryed to explain it that conquering rosacea, those big doses aren't needable, but she kept just saying that it will work and if I want the same results I shold do so. So, right now I took 40mg and I really dont know how to continue. That faster results sounds better (of course), but in last winter as I've wroted, I took it about 3-4 months in 20mg/day dose and it didn't do much of a nothing on my nose. I've also tryed to get that ketotifen which Callien told about his post (little upper) but can't get it anywhere, I would be so happy if someone could just send it to me :( So, what would you tell me to do with accutane?

So far as I've told, the rozex (same as metrogel) has been the only postivive medicine/treatment which has helped me, so I thought that if here fourm has ANYONE who has also got help from metrogel, and later on find some even more powerful treatment to cure his rosacea, please write in this topic or privatemessage me, because I really think that it would help me also.

Also, if you have ANY ideas what more to do, please write those, because as I've said thousand of times, im so desperated with this that im ready to do almost anything, as you've seen :(

[claudia]

Hi Bonefish,

Don't lose hope...we all suffer in one way or another! Are you seeing a rosacea specialist or just a regular dermatologist? The reason I'm asking is that you need someone who is an expert in treating rosacea...not the usual kind of derm who thinks accutane will cure anything. I'm concerned about the high dosage of accutane that you're taking and also that other treatments aren't being explored.

Personally, metrogel 1% has worked really well for me...especially in reducing swelling. I know lots of folks say it didn't work for them but they might not have tried the newer version of metrogel and they might not have the swelling...something metrogel seems to help. Although I think you'll benefit from metrogel, you'll also need stronger treatment regimes specifically targeted to reducing the excess tissue growth.

It's worth your money to go see a real rosacea derm, even if you have to travel a distance. Do you have any teaching hospitals near you? They are excellent for getting references to well respected derms who specialize.

Hang in there...and don't lose hope!

[Bonefish]

Thank you claudia, im not losing hope even it seems so hard because nothing seems to work :cry: Im trying to find a rosacea speasilist derm from Finland.. I decided to go 10mg/day dose accutane for a long time. I really dont know how to survive through the summer, guess its spoiled once again.. :cry:

Im also about to buy ketotifen on onlinepharmacy, but I would like to know how long and what dose should I take it to get the best benefit from it? Because allthought seems like ketotifen is pretty expensive drug :(

Here is the thread where dr.nase tells about ketotifen: http://forum.rosaceagroup.org/viewtopic.php?t=2354&highlight=ketotifen

And for caudia: Did you mean 1% metroCREAM, because if so, I've had it and it didn't work as well as 0,75% metroGEL (dont know why). Or is there 1% metrogel also available? Because I haven't found that.

[Mknlvi]

... I decided to go 10mg/day dose accutane for a long time. I really dont know how to survive through the summer, guess its spoiled once again.. :cry:

Im also about to buy ketotifen on onlinepharmacy, but I would like to know how long and what dose should I take it to get the best benefit from it? Because allthought seems like ketotifen is pretty expensive drug :(

Here is the thread where dr.nase tells about ketotifen: http://forum.rosaceagroup.org/viewtopic.php?t=2354&highlight=ketotifen


I also have the swollen nose problem, no papules or pustules. Something causes my flareups when I sleep and by the morning my nose is always swollen.
I tried Ketotifen in the UK for an allergy 2 years ago and it did nothing by itself (I couldn't get Accutance prescribed at the same time).

About the accutane dose, the studies on pubmed show low dose Accutane at 5mg a day or 10mg three times a week (once every other day) to get the maximum anti-inflammatory effect without all the horrible side effects .

[Bonefish]

I decided to update my thread after a long time.

Here is my recent situation (pic taken about 2 weeks ago), nothing has changed =( :
http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm289/MiKKo_2008_/phyma.jpg

So im right now in the army. Im going to try ZZ-ointment+accutane(at low dose)+zyrtec after summer (because the sun) and end in in next spring. Still if here is anyone get rid of phymatous rosacea I'd like to hear the story or someone who know possible methods of getting rid of this.

[Bonefish]

I update this again a little bit. Soon im going to start the long accutane + ZZ-ointment regime. Last time I took acctaune at pretty big dosage I got KP (Keratosis Pilaris) I believe in my arms! Im not sure it might also be due to gymtraining but I doubt it, I think accutane just dryed my skin too much and somehow lauched the KP-reaction... Now I've put a grease called Calmuril (desinged to treat diseases like kp) but so far it hasen't helped. I started to find info about KP and found this forum desinged to help ppls with KP: http://www.keratosispilaris.org/forums/

Then I found this (http://www.keratosispilaris.org/general-discussion/5830-sea-buckthorn-treatment-guide.html) thread at forum where is mention that rosacea and KP are pretty similar. This is why I think more that ZZ-ointment would help.. Here is a pics of my kp also... :

http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm273/MiKKo_2008_2008/kp.jpg

[yellowred]

I think that I'm in the same situation as you, my thread is this:

http://www.rosaceagroup.org/The_Rosacea_Forum/showthread.php?t=16034


I have been in two doctor and they never told me it was rosacea but my nose are always red, under my arms i have the same as you. currently I have had 5 IPL sessions in my nose without success and 2 PDL ssesions in my nose without success too.