when dr nase Rosacea Forum will be ready?

[Heady]

I want to know wt time the Unique Rosacea Forum will be ready?
I m so excited about the forum which will provide lots of latest
Rosacea treatment........and also helps us to identity the best treatment
to treat this ruin life disorder...........

Anyone have any information about the forum.........When will it finish and available? dr nase please update your work regularly......Because many resacea sufferers needs u to give us hope.........Thanks^^

[IowaDavid]

If I remember correctly, it's been in the works for close to a year now.
Hopefully, it will be well worth the wait. 8)

[fut]

Hopefully it doesn't cost money...

[IowaDavid]

Hopefully it doesn't cost money...

Well, we can only hope that altruistic "rosacea specialists" won't charge rosacea sufferers for information that will--clearly--help them get their lives back.

As I see things, one must be forgiven for doubting rosacea evangelists that have monied interests in given treatment modalities, especially when said "evangelists" fail to produce any tangible, consistent treatment modalities for rosacea sufferers.

Please educate yourself, and make your decisions for treatment modalities after reading about your particular subtype and the efficacy of the available treatments as they pertain to your specific case.


David

[Carlitos]

I'm not looking forward for the forum. To pay money for information found for free on the web...... Forum not for me...... but good luck.

[MARPUSBEAN]

I, for one, am looking forward to Dr. Nase getting his forum going!
No I am not somebody who hangs slavishly on every word he says, or tries every product he mentions, far from it.
The big advantage of a guy like Nase being involved with our forums is that he is a wealth of information on products and scientific papers (some of it useless), it saves me a lot of time, I can then look at these things in detail myself, and decide whether I think it is worth pursuing.
I do the same thing with other peoples suggestions.
Thats my view on Dr. Nase, he is a very useful aid in finding solutions to my problems, but, of course, not the only one.
I feel if more people had had this view rather than going the route of hero worship, or alternatively the route of extreme opposition, things would have been quiter and more constructive.
I understand he has to shoulder some of the blame by playing along with this guru like image.
I will certainly join his forum and use it as one of many sources of info, but certainly not the fountainhead of all knowledge.

[Carlitos]

The real question to ask: Why does Dr. Nase endorse some products and not others?

Don’t be misled by Dr. Nase's endorsements. Most of them are for profit.
He is paid to endorse / advertise a product for profit; as we all witnessed with the Laser treatments and others.

Don’t allow high-pressure salesmanship to persuade you to sign up for an information forum that should be free for everyone.

Take time to decide what’s right for you. As for me, I already decided what is right and what is WRONG.

[scrumptious]

I don't understand why it is taking so long to be honest. i guess the tech people who are setting it up must be busy with other projects. it takes only a few minutes to install a board on a server and then say a minute to type the link into a website to lead people there.

[Bob Bear]

I guess he must be biding his time, waiting until he can get his academic brethren on board. The technical side might be short work, but getting everyone together (especially when they have other projects) must take some time and organisation.

Personally, I wish Geoffrey all the best with this project. I think he needs his own place now, and it can only benefit everyone at the end of the day.

BB

[prometheus]

The real question to ask: Why does Dr. Nase endorse some products and not others?

Don’t be misled by Dr. Nase's endorsements. Most of them are for profit.
He is paid to endorse / advertise a product for profit; as we all witnessed with the Laser treatments and others.

Don’t allow high-pressure salesmanship to persuade you to sign up for an information forum that should be free for everyone.

Take time to decide what’s right for you. As for me, I already decided what is right and what is WRONG.

How did Dr. Nase profit from telling me to switch from metrogel to noritate? How did Dr. Nase profit from telling me which high blood pressure medicine to take? How did Dr. Nase profit from telling me which antiobiotics to try when I had a reaction to dynacin? How did Dr. Nase profit from looking at my pictures and recommending a treatment regimen for me? How did Dr. Nase profit form the endless e-mails and conversations helping me figure this rosacea crap out?

Nice of you to try and insult someone who can't come in here and defend himself.

Do you have Rosacea Carlito? I bet you would recommend certain things but not others based on your personal experience. I guess you must be making a profit some how, heaven forbid he may actually be trying to help someone.

Heaven forbid he make money on his passion in life. Rosacea and helping people with Rosacea. I guess all your doctors, therapists, mediums, consultants.... they all work for free.

Good job Carlito.... good job.

[Bonefish]

Why don't you just email him? drnase1000@hotmail.com
I emailed him about other thing and got answer that there is over 2000 (if I remember correclty) mails waiting for his reply so..

[DukeCity]

Well written Prometheus..

[ledbetteroregon]

[edited out by moderator]

amen Prometheus! if it wasnt for dr. nase, i'd still be putting **** on my face thinking that its helping my skin.

[patrice]

Spot on Prometheus !
Patrice

[Rick]

I did see Nase mention awhile ago that one purpose of his long-awaited site would be to serve an Rosacea patient advocate, the implication being that he expects to continue to expose the various paid "agents" of well-known IPL practitioners and other devices like LED arrays etc. Of course, I assume he will exclude his own lucrative, albeit terminated, contract with Jerry Darm whereby he would get paid $7500 a month to promote Darm, with performance measured by new client acquisition. Veterans here know where to find the pdf of the actual contract ...

Now, something constructive. Nase has any number of full-length papers on rosacea that are hard to obtain. What would really add value would be offering scanned versions of these papers, tagged with keywords and a search mechanism to locate them. Maybe the legion of "IT experts" working for him could handle this. Alas, there may be some copyright issues here, but I personally would find this quite compelling. Of course, he will block my IP address and those of other "troublemakers" (aka dissenters) to keep things "constructive".

Rick

[Carlitos]

No need for my reply to Dr. Nase's followers. Rick answer all for me.

Amen Rick....

[prometheus]

No need for my reply to Dr. Nase's followers. Rick answer all for me.

Amen Rick....

What did he answer for you? He didn't say anything except that Dr. Nase wants to make a living and has more to offer than anyone else here. I guess you agree. Try to attach yourself to someone that actually strengthens your position.

[MARPUSBEAN]

This is what I keep repeating over and over again, a man with Geoffreys qualifications and his age must expect to earn at least $135,000 a year when offered a research/teaching post, that is if he is ambitious!
Now just suppose he decides to make a career out of freelance rosacea research, and running his own advice service for rosacea sufferers?
Clearly some people believe he will do this without eating, paying the rent, or running a motor vehicle, or anything else , because he may not make any money!!!
When we have IPL and laser treatmant we realise how much these practitioners make and deserve, but Geoffrey may not even make half of it.
It is anyway self controling, the people who do not like him, do not believe anything of what he says, are not interested in what he may offer will not have to spend one cent with him, or on any products he reccomends, so why do they complain, it is not a dictatorship they do not have to deal with him or pay him anything.
Look at me, I agree with a lot of what he says, and over the years I have been helped a great deal by his recomendations!!
I have to confess I never have bought his book, I never paid him anything, I never had any treatment done by anyone recomended by him, most products I have bought have been generic and could be bought from any number of sources, so there he could not earn anything!
I have learnt a lot all free of charge!!

[Carlitos]

prometheus:

Do you have a problem with me? or is this your relief from rosacea stress?

If it makes you feel better keep on writting and attacking, it does not bother me.

Good Day...

[prometheus]

prometheus:

Do you have a problem with me? or is this your relief from rosacea stress?

If it makes you feel better keep on writting and attacking, it does not bother me.

Good Day...

I don't have a problem with you carlitos, I just think you're ignorant. And this post strengthens that thought.

And I don't attack you, I respond to any post that I think is stupid and damaging. You wont find a post from me attacking you that is not in response to some post that you made.

[Carlitos]

keep on going.. does not bother me (again)

Good day (again)....

[Callien]

Here we go again. Geoffrey Nase walks on water and is the greatest thing since sliced bread versus Geoffrey Nase is the devil incarnate. I doubt if Roche and Galderma have paid him for his advice. As for kickbacks from other recommendations, who knows? I personally don’t care. He’s smart and he knows this disease and if he can find something that works for us I don’t care if he becomes a multi-gazillionaire. I know there have been disagreements and I try to stay objective but when it’s the same thing over and over again it gets old.

[DukeCity]

"Geoffery Nase walks on water" -- I would tend to agree with you on that point, - I once saw him walk across the Wabash, but it was frozen at the time.. does that count???

[Steve95301]

Constructive threads about Dr. Nase are impossible. Any thread about Dr. Nase should be deleted immediately. It's the same old crap every time.

[clsykes00]

In my opinion, the quality of the content of this site has greatly suffered since Dr. Nase has not been around. I would be surprised if someone has a different opinion. We as a group just don't seem nearly qualified and motivated to help others. That is not meant to be a slight on us (including myself), just means that our comparative advantages are found elsewhere.

Best,
Trey

[prometheus]

In my opinion, the quality of the content of this site has greatly suffered since Dr. Nase has not been around. I would be surprised if someone has a different opinion. We as a group just don't seem nearly qualified and motivated to help others. That is not meant to be a slight on us (including myself), just means that our comparative advantages are found elsewhere.

Best,
Trey

Agreed.

[Carlitos]

prometheus keep on showing us your brilliance and Intelligence.

Who is Marc? Never heard of him before.

As for calling me a Moron:
Fair enough, but as an example of robust invective, your effort falls in a class between pitiful and pathetic. you struck not with a swordsman's rapier but with a caveman's club. Who could take offense at such billingsgate? Like the hook slide and the squeeze bunt, a good mouth-filling insult is a work of art. Let us learn by prometheus good example.

[prometheus]

prometheus keep on showing us your brilliance and Intelligence.

Who is Marc? Never heard of him before.

As for calling me a Moron:
Fair enough, but as an example of robust invective, your effort falls in a class between pitiful and pathetic. you struck not with a swordsman's rapier but with a caveman's club. Who could take offense at such billingsgate? Like the hook slide and the squeeze bunt, a good mouth-filling insult is a work of art. Let us learn by prometheus good example.

Sad, very sad.

Unless you want to accumulate a long list of examples of Carlitos's acts of corruption and depredation, this letter may become a bit monotonous. However, I definitely do hope you read it all the way through because self-pitying smut peddlers do not deserve the assistance they receive from society. Let me get to the crux of the matter: You may have noticed that Carlitos simply spouts endless fine-sounding cliches along with unintelligible, prudish dialectic. But you don't know the half of it. For starters, the main dissensus between me and Carlitos is that I suspect that for his own sake, Carlitos should not separate people from their roots and cut their bonds to their natural communities. Carlitos, on the other hand, contends that supercilious mouthpieces for snivelling deconstructionism are inherently good, sensitive, creative, and inoffensive. The facts are, succinctly, these: First, his simplistic reasoning follows the same fallacies as so many other treatises on similar issues. Second, Carlitos is totally mistaken if he believes that black is white and night is day. Okay, I've written enough for one letter, so let me just finish by saying that flattery will get Carlitos nowhere.

Still, this letter was the best way to explain to you that I can say with absolute certitude that Carlitos's excuses are brain-damaged in their impact, indecent in their aspirations, offensive in their political deviousness, and crazy in their pharisaical philosophies.

[redhotoz]

Another thread locked with a 24 hour cool down period guys and gals!

Red

[Carlitos]

prometheus
Are you ready for second round?

[Bob Bear]

Now lets see a good clean fight, no butting, elbows or low blows...

DING DING

[prometheus]

prometheus
Are you ready for second round?

Carlitos, I already told you that I'm not going to talk to you, I'm not going to attack you, I'm not going to bother you at all.

The only thing I will do is to point out any incorrect or misleading posts that you make.

If you want to start a fight with me, go right ahead. Hopefully the mods will do their jobs.

[IowaDavid]

I did see Nase mention awhile ago that one purpose of his long-awaited site would be to serve an Rosacea patient advocate, the implication being that he expects to continue to expose the various paid "agents" of well-known IPL practitioners and other devices like LED arrays etc.

Just so everyone knows: I am not paid by anyone to advocate LED treatment.

Moreover, Dr. Geoffery Nase was falsifying "patient testimonials" in regard to red light therapy "burning" rosaceans.

I will defy anyone that reads posts on this forum to show me any legitimate documentation that backs Dr. Nase's posts regarding the alleged "damage" red light therapy caused rosaceans.

I'm sorry, but I don't think Geoffery is an adovcate for sick people anymore. He strikes me as a self-serving man with a medical degree and an agenda.

Just the way I see things.

If you can enlighten me, please PM me or post regarding this matter.

David

[redhotoz]

Since I have become interested in red light therapy, I asked my friend, who is an electrician, what he thought about LED light, since he is going to help me attach the power source to my unit. He said "It is impossible to get burns from LED light!" He also went on to say that LED light did not emit heat. He was astounded when I mentioned that it had been said on this Forum that people burnt their faces by using LED lights.

Well, let me tell you, he is not about to allow me to stick my face under anything that has any possibility of burning my face!

I'm very excited about giving red LED treatment a go. I just have to get my act in order and buy the power source so it can get under way!

Jen

[prometheus]

I'm sorry, but I don't think Geoffery is an adovcate for sick people anymore. He strikes me as a self-serving man with a medical degree and an agenda.

You revive a thread that's been dead for 2 weeks just to insult someone who can't defend himself and he's the one with the agenda?

[redhotoz]

I'm sorry, but I don't think Geoffery is an adovcate for sick people anymore. He strikes me as a self-serving man with a medical degree and an agenda.

You revive a thread that's been dead for 2 weeks just to insult someone who can't defend himself and he's the one with the agenda?

In all honesty Prometheus, this does warrant taking the time to look at the bigger picture.

Perhaps look at it from a different angle...

Let's say you started using something that nobody else has tried which has been really helpful with controlling your Rosacea. You put a new thread up about it with great excitement. Questions come in and answers are given to the best of your ability and knowledge. You are open to suggestions and ideas on how to make it better. Then, all of a sudden, your recommendation becomes a target of a personal vendetta towards someone else. You can't understand why your helpful idea has been shot down in flames for no apparent reason. Perhaps just because you have been in contact with that other person? Who knows? What an awful position to be in!

So, let's be kind about this. A suggestion has been made by a fellow Rosacean who is only relaying helpful information. As we all know with Rosacea, what works for one person may not work for another, so this may not be what you might want to try right now.

But would you want to be shot down in flames for mentioning something that has worked well for you?

Prometheus, I am not trying to pick a fight or be irrational about this. Perhaps you haven't noticed what happened a while back in regards to this particular suggestion? I don't know.

But hey, let's all try to keep the peace here and be kind to each other. David is due a rap over the knuckles for re-hashing, but doesn't everyone deserve to be excited about something that has made their Rosacea better, without someone dogging you for it?

On a personal note, I want to try red LED therapy from home. My Derm said that I was welcome to use his commercial unit any time I wanted to but that is 600kms away from where I live (he visits my town every quarter for consultations). My Derm challenges me to prove things that are supposedly beneficial for Rosacea, so I am taking up that challenge. If he we wants me to be his guinea pig Rosacean, then so be it. It's not going to hurt me! Gosh, my electrician friend said that LED light is like shining a big torch (flash light) in your face. That is, no harm whatsoever, no possibility of burns! So what do I have to lose? Nothing! What could I possibly gain? A nicer face!

Jen

[keisha06]

Personally, I would imagine red light therapy would be like most possible treatments for Rosacea, for some it will work well, others do nothing, and perhaps others, make worse. That seems to be the case with IPL/Laser (there have been posting from people who go to the most often mentioned practioners and they are all over the map as to results) and with many other treatments.

As to Dr Nase, I don't know why it has to keep coming up, but I will say that in about December he mentioned Lyrica, for those with neural burning. I don't know what gain he got out of bringing that up (and I can assure you - my Doctor wouldn't have) - but I checked it out and decided it sounded like it might work for me and it has made a difference for me (though it sound like most things, for some it hasn't - think there is a theme here?).

I'm actually more turned off by someone bringing up a treatment that has worked well for them, but who can't do so without calling someone else down than simply an endorsment of a method that has worked for him/her due to personal experience.

[Callien]

Medical degree?

[Steve95301]

Medical degree?
Yeah I caught that too.

[prometheus]

I'm sorry, but I don't think Geoffery is an adovcate for sick people anymore. He strikes me as a self-serving man with a medical degree and an agenda.

You revive a thread that's been dead for 2 weeks just to insult someone who can't defend himself and he's the one with the agenda?

In all honesty Prometheus, this does warrant taking the time to look at the bigger picture.

Perhaps look at it from a different angle...

Let's say you started using something that nobody else has tried which has been really helpful with controlling your Rosacea. You put a new thread up about it with great excitement. Questions come in and answers are given to the best of your ability and knowledge. You are open to suggestions and ideas on how to make it better. Then, all of a sudden, your recommendation becomes a target of a personal vendetta towards someone else. You can't understand why your helpful idea has been shot down in flames for no apparent reason. Perhaps just because you have been in contact with that other person? Who knows? What an awful position to be in!

So, let's be kind about this. A suggestion has been made by a fellow Rosacean who is only relaying helpful information. As we all know with Rosacea, what works for one person may not work for another, so this may not be what you might want to try right now.

But would you want to be shot down in flames for mentioning something that has worked well for you?

Prometheus, I am not trying to pick a fight or be irrational about this. Perhaps you haven't noticed what happened a while back in regards to this particular suggestion? I don't know.

But hey, let's all try to keep the peace here and be kind to each other. David is due a rap over the knuckles for re-hashing, but doesn't everyone deserve to be excited about something that has made their Rosacea better, without someone dogging you for it?

On a personal note, I want to try red LED therapy from home. My Derm said that I was welcome to use his commercial unit any time I wanted to but that is 600kms away from where I live (he visits my town every quarter for consultations). My Derm challenges me to prove things that are supposedly beneficial for Rosacea, so I am taking up that challenge. If he we wants me to be his guinea pig Rosacean, then so be it. It's not going to hurt me! Gosh, my electrician friend said that LED light is like shining a big torch (flash light) in your face. That is, no harm whatsoever, no possibility of burns! So what do I have to lose? Nothing! What could I possibly gain? A nicer face!

Jen

I'm not trying to pick a fight either. I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of a certain mod here is most humorous. And self serving.

[clsykes00]

I would be curious what agenda you think Dr Nase has? I think if you accuse someone, you should have more substance to back your accusation.

Dr. Nase has been a very strong proponent of Accutane. As a result, I am on accutane now. I am still scratching my head on the benefits Dr Nase is receiving from me being on Accutane. Maybe you can answer that for me?

[prometheus]

I would be curious what agenda you think Dr Nase has? I think if you accuse someone, you should have more substance to back your accusation.

Dr. Nase has been a very strong proponent of Accutane. As a result, I am on accutane now. I am still scratching my head on the benefits Dr Nase is receiving from me being on Accutane. Maybe you can answer that for me?

I'm still trying to figure out how he got rich telling me what high blood pressure medicine to take. And the millions he made giving me a treatment protocol to try via pm's.

Seems to me the guy took the time out of his life to help me at no cost and with no rewards other than my thanks.

If he makes a statement that someone doesn't agree with, they attack him. If he says nothing, they attack him.......

[redhotoz]

I'm actually more turned off by someone bringing up a treatment that has worked well for them, but who can't do so without calling someone else down than simply an endorsment of a method that has worked for him/her due to personal experience.

Hi Diane

With respect, David did start out talking about his personal experiences with this method. Unfortunately, he became a target due to a personal vendetta between two other people. This may not have been obvious to some but it wasn't very nice.

Personal insults are a pretty low blow and I hope it stops. Diane, I am NOT including you in that, as you often present a well thought through reply, but perhaps do not know the full background of where this has all stemmed from? In some respects, it is all irrelevant now but people are only human. It's not always easy to forgive and forget.

Anyway, I hope we can all move on.

Getting back to the thread title, has anyone heard of a date for Geoffrey's new forum to be started?

Jen

[IowaDavid]

I'm sorry, but I don't think Geoffery is an adovcate for sick people anymore. He strikes me as a self-serving man with a medical degree and an agenda.

You revive a thread that's been dead for 2 weeks just to insult someone who can't defend himself and he's the one with the agenda?


You think my interest here is to cherry-pick old threads to insult people for my own ego fluffing?

Are you that simple, for real?

I read a comment that pertained to LED therapy that I had missed when it was first posted. I responded to the idea that LED therapy is some sort of bogus treatment modality.

Dr. Nase falsified information to support his own megalomaniacal view of himself and understanding of our shared disease, which is why I asked anyone here to support what he'd posted.

Sorry, I'm after truth here, not personality cult blind devotion. I'm not cutting at anything Nase has done for our community in the past. I'm cutting at his behavior of late as he has not been truthful with our community, and his comments regarding LED therapy are case in point falsified bluster.

He has my email address. If he cares to respond to me via email, I will gladly post it in this forum unedited.

I'm happy that you've found treatment for your rosacea given Dr. Nase's advice--I have found that he has been instrumental in my knowledge of the disease and my own struggles over the past few years.

But I will not abide when icons of the rosacea community make blatantly erroneous claims.

David

[clsykes00]

[quote=Rick]I'm sorry, but I don't think Geoffery is an adovcate for sick people anymore. He strikes me as a self-serving man with a medical degree and an agenda.
David

I still do not see a motive in your explanation. Please, if you make such a serious accusation, you should really back it up with a motive. Movite justifies actions. You have only made claims of action.

[IowaDavid]

[quote=Rick]I'm sorry, but I don't think Geoffery is an adovcate for sick people anymore. He strikes me as a self-serving man with a medical degree and an agenda.
David

I still do not see a motive in your explanation. Please, if you make such a serious accusation, you should really back it up with a motive. Movite justifies actions. You have only made claims of action.

I was expressing an opinion based on the information I have read/heard.

So, we need a motive for an explanation?

My motive for my action (posting) was seeing false information disseminated to this group.

A serious accusation needs to be backed with a motive?

Shouldn't an accusation be backed by a rational argument rather than a motive which may be self-serving?

Straighten your terms out, please, if you'd like to debate this.

[Callien]

Geoffrey's claims were backed up by Dr. Peter Crouch which led me to believe that maybe there is a risk with red light for some people. This doesn't mean that I doubt the success that Peter and David have had. It just means I'll wait for the clinical trials. I'm also curious about Kristen's success because it appears that whatever success she might have had with red light didn't last.

[IowaDavid]

Geoffrey's claims were backed up by Dr. Peter Crouch which led me to believe that maybe there is a risk with red light for some people. This doesn't mean that I doubt the success that Peter and David have had. It just means I'll wait for the clinical trials. I'm also curious about Kristen's success because it appears that whatever success she might have had with red light didn't last.

Ask Kristen.

Ask Dr. Crouch for documentation.

Ask Peter for a 7-year diary of red light use.

Ask Dr. Tony Chu about his interest in red light therapy.


Email me.
I'm David. How many pages and photos of my set-up do you want? If you want to discuss something for real, honest, intellectual ends, email me. PM me. You can have my email addy.
I think I might be able to bore you....

Stop wasting rosaceans' time with this drivel. Take it up with me. I love nothing more than to talk and exchange information.

Again: PM me for my email addy. I'm more than willing to email with you. :D

[Callien]

I said I believe you and Peter and the success you've had with the red light. I also believe Dr. Chu's interest in the red light and await the results of his studies. I question if the red light has continued to work for Kristen because my understanding is that it hasn't. As for asking Dr. Crouch for verification I believe it could be a breach of ethics for him to disclose specific information about a specific patient (not sure about UK laws). As far as I know, Dr. Crouch is a well respected Dr. and member of this forum and as such I have no reason to question his integrity. As for Geoffrey, I'll just leave him out of the equation because it inevitably leads to fighting.

[IowaDavid]

Then, by all means--let's forget politics and people and cut to information. Leave everyone else out of this.

PM me for my email addy and we can discuss it from there.

I warn you, though, I may bore you.

Please, do feel free to PM me. I'm more than happy to discuss this subject.


David

[Callien]

Stop wasting rosaceans' time with this drivel.


You are the one who brought up the topic by resurrecting the thread. So are you allowed to publicly state your views but mine are "drivel" and a waste of rosaceans' time? Do you even think about what you say and how it comes across? Or are you deliberately being obtuse? Please stop trying to censor me and try censoring yourself before you post.

[IowaDavid]

Stop wasting rosaceans' time with this drivel.


You are the one who brought up the topic by resurrecting the thread. So are you allowed to publicly state your views but mine are "drivel" and a waste of rosaceans' time? Do you even think about what you say and how it comes across? Or are you deliberately being obtuse? Please stop trying to censor me and try censoring yourself before you post.

Yes, I may be dull if I see a statement that was made on these boards two weeks ago, and then I take issue with that idea today. I'd like to think that people that post here are intelligent enough to consider ideas that are more than a fortnight old.

Yes, I do try to think about how what I say will come across to others. However, I can't determine the mindsets or personal conditions of those that read my posts.

Censorship? I don't understand where you're going with that line of thinking. I'd prefer omni-access to information. But then we'd have drivel, we might offend people, we might excite the passions of those that forgot something that was dead to them two weeks ago....

[clsykes00]

[quote=Rick]I'm sorry, but I don't think Geoffery is an adovcate for sick people anymore. He strikes me as a self-serving man with a medical degree and an agenda.
David

I still do not see a motive in your explanation. Please, if you make such a serious accusation, you should really back it up with a motive. Movite justifies actions. You have only made claims of action.

I was expressing an opinion based on the information I have read/heard.

So, we need a motive for an explanation?

My motive for my action (posting) was seeing false information disseminated to this group.

A serious accusation needs to be backed with a motive?

Shouldn't an accusation be backed by a rational argument rather than a motive which may be self-serving?

Straighten your terms out, please, if you'd like to debate this.

No straightening of terms required. I meant exactly what I wrote.

However, by taking this argument to a personal level proves to me that you are hostile and not credible.

Accusations based on hearsay are, for lack of a better word, limp. Your motive for Dr Nase of you seeing false information is really not a motive. It may be a motive for YOU to write accusatory posts that lack substantiation, but really does not provide any explanation for Dr Nase's motives.

Your demeaning, hostile posts only make you look bad. Can you please be more civil with your posts.

[prometheus]

I'm sorry, but I don't think Geoffery is an adovcate for sick people anymore. He strikes me as a self-serving man with a medical degree and an agenda.

You revive a thread that's been dead for 2 weeks just to insult someone who can't defend himself and he's the one with the agenda?


You think my interest here is to cherry-pick old threads to insult people for my own ego fluffing?

Are you that simple, for real?

I read a comment that pertained to LED therapy that I had missed when it was first posted. I responded to the idea that LED therapy is some sort of bogus treatment modality.

Dr. Nase falsified information to support his own megalomaniacal view of himself and understanding of our shared disease, which is why I asked anyone here to support what he'd posted.

Sorry, I'm after truth here, not personality cult blind devotion. I'm not cutting at anything Nase has done for our community in the past. I'm cutting at his behavior of late as he has not been truthful with our community, and his comments regarding LED therapy are case in point falsified bluster.

He has my email address. If he cares to respond to me via email, I will gladly post it in this forum unedited.

I'm happy that you've found treatment for your rosacea given Dr. Nase's advice--I have found that he has been instrumental in my knowledge of the disease and my own struggles over the past few years.

But I will not abide when icons of the rosacea community make blatantly erroneous claims.

David

Yes, I do think your interests were about your own ego, as they usually are. If the truth is what you were after you could have stopped after your first sentence.

"Just so everyone knows: I am not paid by anyone to advocate LED treatment."

Then you call me simple, and I made a point not to insult you. I'll be sure not to do that again.

Have you finished you application yet though? You are trying to be the new guru right? Taking money to advocate untested treatments, you attack anyone that questions anything you say, heaven forbid someone disagrees with you.... their posts will be deleted and they will have to deal with your wrath.... sound familiar?

Good job.

[prometheus]

[quote=Rick]I'm sorry, but I don't think Geoffery is an adovcate for sick people anymore. He strikes me as a self-serving man with a medical degree and an agenda.
David

I still do not see a motive in your explanation. Please, if you make such a serious accusation, you should really back it up with a motive. Movite justifies actions. You have only made claims of action.

I was expressing an opinion based on the information I have read/heard.

So, we need a motive for an explanation?

My motive for my action (posting) was seeing false information disseminated to this group.

A serious accusation needs to be backed with a motive?

Shouldn't an accusation be backed by a rational argument rather than a motive which may be self-serving?

Straighten your terms out, please, if you'd like to debate this.


It seems that this chuckle monkey is the only one who can express an opinion. Don't anyone else dare.

Seems to me Dr. Nase posted after seeing some of your false information and he backed it up with a rational argument.

[prometheus]

Then, by all means--let's forget politics and people and cut to information. Leave everyone else out of this.

PM me for my email addy and we can discuss it from there.

I warn you, though, I may bore you.

Please, do feel free to PM me. I'm more than happy to discuss this subject.


David


If only you could practice what you preach.

[Callien]

I said in my last post that I would not recommend red light therapy for rosacea.

Geoffrey and I are only urging caution and reiterating that doing anything that increases blood flow seems to be counterintuitive with rosacea

I have no problem with properly constructed/ tested / calibrated devices with FDA approval.

Why is it that these community bulletin boards can't stay focussed on just working constructively together to further expand treatment options for those afflicted with rosacea?

Kind regards,

Peter

I believe it is important to listen to all anecdotal evidence pro and con regarding any rosacea treatment. I consider this a benefit for all members.
IPL, V-beam and accutane have worked for many but some have had negative results. People should be able to choose a treatment after carefully weighing all the evidence.

[redhotoz]

Sorry, I've lost the energy to be rational - in this thread!

It's like...

](*,)

[IowaDavid]

You are trying to be the new guru right?

For god's sake no. I can't say anything, other than that if you think that's what I'm after, then we have had a severe misunderstanding.

Best of luck.

[Callien]

You are trying to be the new guru right? Good job.

A picture is worth a thousand words! Look at the avatar.

[redhotoz]

I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of a certain mod here is most humorous. And self serving.

It saddens me to hear such comments made. Calling someone a self serving hypocrite is a low blow. Laughing it off doesn't make it any better, infact worse, like rubbing salt into a wound! Particularly when you don't even know the person you are accusing. But I am sure you will be happy to hear that David has now resigned as a Moderator on this Forum.

If anyone is interested, personal attacks are in breach of Forum Policies:

http://www.rosaceagroup.org/wiki/Forum_policies

"Behaviour guidelines
Avoid profanity
No personal attacks (and move personal debates to email)
No legal threats
No offensive usernames
Please do not bite the newcomers"

Jenny

[Kelli]

That's really sad... David seems like a good guy.

Are we all that jaded? I mean, that we all seem to have tunnel vision?

[redhotoz]

That's really sad... David seems like a good guy.

Are we all that jaded? I mean, that we all seem to have tunnel vision?

Hi Kelli

I was so sad to hear of David's resignation. Yes, he IS a good guy! Why did he resign? Well, he said that anyone could PM him if they wanted to know the reasons. He'll still be a regular member though, which is great!

Tunnel vision...yes! It seems so for some anyway. So frustrating! I so wish some would take a step backwards for a moment and look at the bigger picture. But I guess we only go by what we know and if we don't know the full story, then it's verbal sling shots! Agggh!

Jen

[Kelli]

SHOOT!!! I forgot to work on something for you! I am so sorry! I jsut remember it. I'll get something to you today (I HOPE! boss isn't in today, so I should be able to. hehe)

yeah - it does help to take a step back. I think part of the problem is that there are SO many types of rosacea here... I don't flush, but others do, so what works for me doesn't work for others. And people who have something that does or doesn't work for them, tend to be a bit pushy about it. I'm guilty of doing that, as is just about everyone here.

We need to keep in mind how many miracles occured in medicine due to mistakes or things that weren't planned.

[prometheus]

I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of a certain mod here is most humorous. And self serving.

It saddens me to hear such comments made. Calling someone a self serving hypocrite is a low blow. Laughing it off doesn't make it any better, infact worse, like rubbing salt into a wound! Particularly when you don't even know the person you are accusing. But I am sure you will be happy to hear that David has now resigned as a Moderator on this Forum.

If anyone is interested, personal attacks are in breach of Forum Policies:

http://www.rosaceagroup.org/wiki/Forum_policies

"Behaviour guidelines
Avoid profanity
No personal attacks (and move personal debates to email)
No legal threats
No offensive usernames
Please do not bite the newcomers"

Jenny

Redhotoz, sometimes the truth hurts. I'm sorry. But its a shame that you don't hold your own moderators up to the same standards. Calling someone simple I guess is not a low blow. Not to mention various other insults to other people as well. As far as I know, David doesn't know me.

And yes, I am happy because my opinion is that he abused his powers as a mod in this forum. But you can make me the bad person here, I don't mind. It just shows that you are being hypocritical as well.

And if you notice in your rules about not biting the newcomers, well..... I think your mods need some re-training.

[Callien]

Stop wasting rosaceans' time with this drivel.

I'm sorry, but I don't think Geoffery is an adovcate for sick people anymore. He strikes me as a self-serving man with a medical degree and an agenda.

Are you that simple, for real?

Dr. Nase falsified information to support his own megalomaniacal view of himself and understanding of our shared disease, which is why I asked anyone here to support what he'd posted.

Yes, I do try to think about how what I say will come across to others. However, I can't determine the mindsets or personal conditions of those that read my posts.




First off, I need to apologize for the avatar comment. It was an easy shot after the guru remark. And I really don't doubt that David is sincere and a nice guy but the statements above are things he has said just from this thread alone. There are other threads where he has made similar comments. When I brought this to his attention his response is that it is the "mindset or personal condition" of those who read his posts. In other words, if he says offensive things and you are offended by them then it's your fault?
He insults Geoffrey after he is long gone and no longer around to defend himself when he must know that this is disruptive and not conductive to the forum at all but when I try to consider what Dr. Crouch has said about red light therapy and how increased blood flow could be harmful to rosacea skin he accuses me of "drivel" and "wasting rosaceans' time". Why is he not able to consider another opinion to red light therapy? Personally, I'm sitting on the fence with it but I would like to weigh all the evidence.

[redhotoz]

Redhotoz, sometimes the truth hurts. I'm sorry. But its a shame that you don't hold your own moderators up to the same standards. Calling someone simple I guess is not a low blow. Not to mention various other insults to other people as well. As far as I know, David doesn't know me.

And yes, I am happy because my opinion is that he abused his powers as a mod in this forum. But you can make me the bad person here, I don't mind. It just shows that you are being hypocritical as well.

And if you notice in your rules about not biting the newcomers, well..... I think your mods need some re-training.

Hi John

Firstly, I am just like everyone else here. The only difference is that if someone breaks the 'rules' and I notice it, then I act upon it. You were invited to be a Mod at the same time as I was but you chose not to take it on board. I don't know your reasons for this. One of the reasons I said that I would never want to be a Mod is because it looked like Mods just got attacked for no good reason. But I thought I could perhaps help in some way - that's my nature - I like to help.

The truth? You are stating as a matter of fact that David is a self serving hypocrite? Well, I am glad you are sorry, because that is an awful thing to say about someone you don't know!

I am assuming that you meant David called you "simple" at some point in time, as I don't believe I have or would ever say that about anyone! I'm sorry if you have been labelled as being simple.

Oh, by the way, they are not MY moderators, I'm just one of the Moderators who volunteers my time here. To be honest, I don't really know how a Mod could abuse the so called powers. If I do anything on the Forum, it has to be within the Forum Policies and if I am unsure about anything, I ask for advice from the other Mods. Mods have removed other Mods posts and threads just like everyone else here. But, since you decided not to become a Mod, I guess you wouldn't know that.

You think my aim was to make you the bad person and that I am a hypocrite as well? ](*,) I think I should just say that I replied to a post you replied to from me. Are we going in circles here?

The rules are not MY rules or MY Moderators to train! Pleeease! I have never been nasty to a newcomer here. In fact, I would have to say that this post is probably the most direct one I have ever made because I am usually quite rational and kind to everyone!

Now, back to basics. Let's attempt to wipe the slate clean. I was upset with your reply to my post. I am not David and you can take any personal grievances you have up with him. My name is Jenny (Jen) and I hope that we can get along, because unless a cure for Rosacea is found, I guess I will be hanging around for quite some time!

Jen

[prometheus]

Redhotoz, sometimes the truth hurts. I'm sorry. But its a shame that you don't hold your own moderators up to the same standards. Calling someone simple I guess is not a low blow. Not to mention various other insults to other people as well. As far as I know, David doesn't know me.

And yes, I am happy because my opinion is that he abused his powers as a mod in this forum. But you can make me the bad person here, I don't mind. It just shows that you are being hypocritical as well.

And if you notice in your rules about not biting the newcomers, well..... I think your mods need some re-training.

Hi John

Firstly, I am just like everyone else here. The only difference is that if someone breaks the 'rules' and I notice it, then I act upon it. You were invited to be a Mod at the same time as I was but you chose not to take it on board. I don't know your reasons for this. One of the reasons I said that I would never want to be a Mod is because it looked like Mods just got attacked for no good reason. But I thought I could perhaps help in some way - that's my nature - I like to help.

The truth? You are stating as a matter of fact that David is a self serving hypocrite? Well, I am glad you are sorry, because that is an awful thing to say about someone you don't know!

I am assuming that you meant David called you "simple" at some point in time, as I don't believe I have or would ever say that about anyone! I'm sorry if you have been labelled as being simple.

Oh, by the way, they are not MY moderators, I'm just one of the Moderators who volunteers my time here. To be honest, I don't really know how a Mod could abuse the so called powers. If I do anything on the Forum, it has to be within the Forum Policies and if I am unsure about anything, I ask for advice from the other Mods. Mods have removed other Mods posts and threads just like everyone else here. But, since you decided not to become a Mod, I guess you wouldn't know that.

You think my aim was to make you the bad person and that I am a hypocrite as well? ](*,) I think I should just say that I replied to a post you replied to from me. Are we going in circles here?

The rules are not MY rules or MY Moderators to train! Pleeease! I have never been nasty to a newcomer here. In fact, I would have to say that this post is probably the most direct one I have ever made because I am usually quite rational and kind to everyone!

Now, back to basics. Let's attempt to wipe the slate clean. I was upset with your reply to my post. I am not David and you can take any personal grievances you have up with him. My name is Jenny (Jen) and I hope that we can get along, because unless a cure for Rosacea is found, I guess I will be hanging around for quite some time!

Jen

Hi Jen,

My point is that you put David on this platform and speak of him as he can do no wrong. You criticize my post when I called him a hypocrite and that post was a direct response to a post that he made and called me simple. So I'm assuming that you do not read Davids posts or you would already know this.

Read the post directly above yours and you will see another example of what I'm talking about.

And when you stated that you were sure I would be happy that David resigned as a moderator, that's when you were trying to make me the bad person here. I have no problem with you, I don't have a problem with anyone. My problem is simply that I respond to statements that I think are wrong/false/damaging. I do it to everyone, moderators and people like marc.

But especially when a moderator makes a damaging post and breaks the forums rules, I tend to point that out. Like revivng a 2 week old thread to insult someone and calling someone else simple and telling someone else what they say is drivel and basically insulting everyone who opposes everything he says.

But you get my point. I hope they find a cure so we can all be on our merry way. And as far as I'm concerned, the slate is clean.

[redhotoz]

Hi Jen,

My point is that you put David on this platform and speak of him as he can do no wrong. You criticize my post when I called him a hypocrite and that post was a direct response to a post that he made and called me simple. So I'm assuming that you do not read Davids posts or you would already know this.

Read the post directly above yours and you will see another example of what I'm talking about.

And when you stated that you were sure I would be happy that David resigned as a moderator, that's when you were trying to make me the bad person here. I have no problem with you, I don't have a problem with anyone. My problem is simply that I respond to statements that I think are wrong/false/damaging. I do it to everyone, moderators and people like marc.

But especially when a moderator makes a damaging post and breaks the forums rules, I tend to point that out. Like revivng a 2 week old thread to insult someone and calling someone else simple and telling someone else what they say is drivel and basically insulting everyone who opposes everything he says.

But you get my point. I hope they find a cure so we can all be on our merry way. And as far as I'm concerned, the slate is clean.

Fair call John. I guess it could look like I put David on a platform, but I don't. He is a good bloke though. You may also recall that I said he should get a rap over the knuckles for re-hashing this thread!

John, perhaps it's the fact that you "do it to everyone" (LOL, don't tell your wife) that has put the shackles up my back on occasion! Grrr! "My problem is simply that I respond to statements that I think are wrong/false/damaging". Yes, but that is what YOU think, not necessarily the truth of the matter! Also, I have to say, there is a lot more to this than David getting narcky. There is a reason for everything. PM or e-mail me and perhaps we can chat.

Jen

[redhotoz]

He insults Geoffrey after he is long gone and no longer around to defend himself when he must know that this is disruptive and not conductive to the forum at all but when I try to consider what Dr. Crouch has said about red light therapy and how increased blood flow could be harmful to rosacea skin he accuses me of "drivel" and "wasting rosaceans' time". Why is he not able to consider another opinion to red light therapy? Personally, I'm sitting on the fence with it but I would like to weigh all the evidence.

Hi Callien

Perhaps it would be prudent to take a step back and ponder WHY???

Why was Geoffrey banned from this Forum?
Why was there such controversy when talking of red light therapy?
Why do so many people feel so strongly about these two issues?

I could give you the answers but I would probably be banned! Yes, even Mods have to abide by the rules!

If you think that you could burn your face by shining a flash light on it, then don't even consider a red light! ](*,) Please...ask an electrician about LED light! Ask the local light shop! Truth!!!??? Yes, that is what is needed and that is what has been sooo frustrating! The truth is you are NOT going to burn your face by sticking it under red LED light!

The rest of the truth, I can't say here, or I will have to lock this thread myself!

Jen

[prometheus]

He insults Geoffrey after he is long gone and no longer around to defend himself when he must know that this is disruptive and not conductive to the forum at all but when I try to consider what Dr. Crouch has said about red light therapy and how increased blood flow could be harmful to rosacea skin he accuses me of "drivel" and "wasting rosaceans' time". Why is he not able to consider another opinion to red light therapy? Personally, I'm sitting on the fence with it but I would like to weigh all the evidence.

Hi Callien

Perhaps it would be prudent to take a step back and ponder WHY???

Why was Geoffrey banned from this Forum?
Why was there such controversy when talking of red light therapy?
Why do so many people feel so strongly about these two issues?

I could give you the answers but I would probably be banned! Yes, even Mods have to abide by the rules!

If you think that you could burn your face by shining a flash light on it, then don't even consider a red light! ](*,) Please...ask an electrician about LED light! Ask the local light shop! Truth!!!??? Yes, that is what is needed and that is what has been sooo frustrating! The truth is you are NOT going to burn your face by sticking it under red LED light!

The rest of the truth, I can't say here, or I will have to lock this thread myself!

Jen

Callien didn't say anything about burning yourself. He said that the increased blood flow could be bad for rosaceans. But none of that has anything to do with what his post actually said. It was about David and the way he acts and what he says and how he treats people. You missed the point entirely.

[clsykes00]

Jen,
Seems like someone in physics, rather than an electrician, would be more appropriate to ask whether LED can be harmful. LEDs in the world of mundane electronics are generally innocuous, but remember LEDs are alot used for lasers, both non-ablative and ablative. Lasers are generally focused light produced from LEDs or other light sources. LEDs do tend to emit a broader spectrum of light, but can still cause physical changes depending on their use and methods.

And as a more basic point, any electronics emit heat, depending on the resistence inherent in the components, etc.

Best,
Trey

[keisha06]

He insults Geoffrey after he is long gone and no longer around to defend himself when he must know that this is disruptive and not conductive to the forum at all but when I try to consider what Dr. Crouch has said about red light therapy and how increased blood flow could be harmful to rosacea skin he accuses me of "drivel" and "wasting rosaceans' time". Why is he not able to consider another opinion to red light therapy? Personally, I'm sitting on the fence with it but I would like to weigh all the evidence.

Hi Callien

Perhaps it would be prudent to take a step back and ponder WHY???

Why was Geoffrey banned from this Forum?
Why was there such controversy when talking of red light therapy?
Why do so many people feel so strongly about these two issues?

I could give you the answers but I would probably be banned! Yes, even Mods have to abide by the rules!

If you think that you could burn your face by shining a flash light on it, then don't even consider a red light! ](*,) Please...ask an electrician about LED light! Ask the local light shop! Truth!!!??? Yes, that is what is needed and that is what has been sooo frustrating! The truth is you are NOT going to burn your face by sticking it under red LED light!

The rest of the truth, I can't say here, or I will have to lock this thread myself!

Jen

LED may or may not burn - I'm not one who knows enough about such things to say one way or the other .. . but I still feel it would be much like any treatment - for some it might help, others do nothing, and still others might get worse. Great for those that it does work for, not so great for those it doesm't (kinda like IPL). Accusations certainly went back and forth between David and Geoffrey but I looked at the basics - different opinions between two opposite sides and I think having that info is healthy (and leaving out the accusations - on both sides - what does posting said opinions have to do with being banned? I thought that came from the accusation part of things so I don't quite see the relevance but maybe I'm missing something). Let those that might consider the treatment see ALL opinions, do their investigating, and make their own decisions from there.

I have seen it said that many will take anything that Geoffrey has said as gospel, I think it would be far truer to say that many have looked at his information and thought it very worth investigating for themselves to see if it might help them. Most on these support groups have to be people who can think for themselves (despite the desperation we all sometimes feel for treatments) because we all know how, by and large, little help we get from doctors and derms.

Personally, I like to see posts for ALL types of outcomes from treatments, including treatments by various IPL docs, even one I have had success from because I think anyone considering it should see all parts - good and bad.

If there is one thing I have learned it is that there is no one size fits all when it comes to Rosacea!

I have really enjoyed David's posts on many topics - including LED (and hope there are more), but have to admit to being tired of seeing every post on it in the last while (at least so it seems) also calling down someone who is no longer on the forum. Let it go.

Amazes me how this can continue to come up and go on (yet here I am contributing . . . :roll: ) but I would like to say thanks to all the moderators (defnitely including David) for all the work you do. I firmly believe that while it is right to point out certain things you feel might not be right, but if you really don't like the way things are run, volunteer and try and change things - those that give their time deserve some consideration for it. Thanks Guys! :D

[redhotoz]

LED may or may not burn - I'm not one who knows enough about such things to say one way or the other .. . but I still feel it would be much like any treatment - for some it might help, others do nothing, and still others might get worse. Great for those that it does work for, not so great for those it doesm't (kinda like IPL). Accusations certainly went back and forth between David and Geoffrey but I looked at the basics - different opinions between two opposite sides and I think having that info is healthy (and leaving out the accusations - on both sides - what does posting said opinions have to do with being banned? I thought that came from the accusation part of things so I don't quite see the relevance but maybe I'm missing something). Let those that might consider the treatment see ALL opinions, do their investigating, and make their own decisions from there.

I have seen it said that many will take anything that Geoffrey has said as gospel, I think it would be far truer to say that many have looked at his information and thought it very worth investigating for themselves to see if it might help them. Most on these support groups have to be people who can think for themselves (despite the desperation we all sometimes feel for treatments) because we all know how, by and large, little help we get from doctors and derms.

Personally, I like to see posts for ALL types of outcomes from treatments, including treatments by various IPL docs, even one I have had success from because I think anyone considering it should see all parts - good and bad.

If there is one thing I have learned it is that there is no one size fits all when it comes to Rosacea!

I have really enjoyed David's posts on many topics - including LED (and hope there are more), but have to admit to being tired of seeing every post on it in the last while (at least so it seems) also calling down someone who is no longer on the forum. Let it go.

Amazes me how this can continue to come up and go on (yet here I am contributing . . . :roll: ) but I would like to say thanks to all the moderators (defnitely including David) for all the work you do. I firmly believe that while it is right to point out certain things you feel might not be right, but if you really don't like the way things are run, volunteer and try and change things - those that give their time deserve some consideration for it. Thanks Guys! :D

Hi Diane

I do enjoy your level headed approach to things. Thank you.

You are quite correct in saying that red light therapy may work for some and not for others, as with anything we try for the control of our Rosacea. Weighing up the pros and cons is important and the more information we have the better. Having said that, we do need to make sure that the information we are receiving is truthful. The accusations that went back and forth evolved from a completely different matter which made it nigh on impossible to discuss facts.

Opinions are one thing, but stating something as being fact when it is not the truth, is very misleading and damaging for everyone. We need to ensure that the information we are receiving is factual, otherwise we can not make an educated evaluation. No, I am not trying to ark this up again and will just leave it at that.

Anyway, I am looking forward to the Hammersmith trials but that will take some time. Until then, I am willing to be a guinea pig. But then, aren't we all our own guinea pigs for everything we try?! Eek! Wish me luck!

I do feel that I owe the posters in this thread an apology! Sorry! Heady asked a simple question, to which there has been no answer. So, does anyone know of a date for when Geoffrey's new forum will be up and running?

Jen

[Callien]

Why was Geoffrey banned from this Forum?
Why was there such controversy when talking of red light therapy?
Why do so many people feel so strongly about these two issues?
Jen
1. I don't know.
2. Because some people choose to make it personal.
3. I don't know. I'm on the fence with both issues.


I could give you the answers but I would probably be banned! If you think that you could burn your face by shining a flash light on it, then don't even consider a red light! ](*,) Please...ask an electrician about LED light! Ask the local light shop! Truth!!!??? Yes, that is what is needed and that is what has been sooo frustrating! The truth is you are NOT going to burn your face by sticking it under red LED light! Jen
Dr. Peter Crouch (not Geoffrey) said increased blood flow caused by red light could be harmful to rosacea skin.


The rest of the truth, I can't say here, or I will have to lock this thread myself!
Jen

I'm sure we can all imagine the worst now.

[redhotoz]

Hi Callien

I had all good intention of dropping this but since you have brought it up again I will reply.

Why was Geoffrey banned from this Forum?

Answer: Because he broke the rules over and over again.

Why was there such controversy when talking of red light therapy?

Answer: Because there was false information given about how red light therapy could harm people, sparked from a personal grievance from one person to the other.

Why do so many people feel so strongly about these two issues?

Answer: Because those who believe the truth should be told are seen as putting someong down and those who think someone is being put down don't know the truth.

Yes, it may sound like I am talking in circles but I feel that it would be inappropriate to say certain things in a public forum. PM me if you want to chat.

Dr. Peter Crouch (not Geoffrey) said increased blood flow caused by red light could be harmful to rosacea skin.

Have you done much research into red light therapy Callien? I would be happy to discuss it in a different thread.

Jen

[Callien]

Hi Callien

I had all good intention of dropping this but since you have brought it up again I will reply.


Didn't know they were rhetorical questions. Apologies *big fluffy hugs all round*

[MARPUSBEAN]

Do I presume that the comment made by redhotz concerning Dr. Crouch means that she knows he is not speaking the truth when he said that red light may cause extra blood flow (which would not help).
Is this statement by based on medical or scientific knowledge.
I am asking this because of the high regard Dr. Crouch is held in his field,
and this is a serious questioning of his honesty and knowledge!
I suppose this post will be removed because you do not like it, but surely a moderator also has to offer some justification of what they say.

[MARPUSBEAN]

Further to my last post, I forgot to mention that I do not feel strongly, either, regarding red light, I have an open mind about this subject.
However I am less open minded about this suggestion that Dr. Crouch may have given false information, I eagerly await some proof to back up this rather unwelcome suggestion from redhotz, who might do well to think before writing.

[redhotoz]

Hello Marpusbean

Just to set the record straight and to make it perfectly clear.

I did NOT say “Dr. Crouch…is not speaking the truth when he said that red light may cause extra blood flow.”

I did NOT say “Dr. Crouch may have given false information.”

Those are your words, NOT mine.

Jenny

[MARPUSBEAN]

Thank you, unfortunately if you could learn to say clearly what you mean, instead of these multiple posts repeating the same information many times.
If you mean what you say then I do not see your need to mention what Dr. Crouch said at all.
Dr Crouch is a very busy man who was simply telling this forum about a problem he had come across at his clinic, at the same time warning people to be careful about constructing something to treat their face with when they might not have the technical expertise to do this!!
This is just the kind of information that we ordinary people, who are on this forum purely to get information about rosacea, need.
I understand that you and other people like to get into these extensive debates about personalities and people who used to post here, and "who said what to who".
I suppose it becomes a kind of hobby, for people who have some time to spare!
You will have to apreciate it is a little disruptive and confusing to those of us who have little time to spare, and are basically just looking for information.
Perhaps we could have a forum for rosacea, and one for fighting, and arguing, I suppose in a way you are missing disruptive elements like Dr. Nase and his attackers, so some of you try and resurrect the arguments.
I do not suppose for one minute you understand how annoying this can be for older people like myself who are less used to your aggressive and fast moving way of life.

[Kelli]

WOW Marpus - I didn't have any problems understanding what Jen was saying. I never thought she was saying Dr. Crouch did anything wrong or gave false information.

Sounds like someone else is trying to start something... :roll:

[redhotoz]

Thank you Kelli.

Marpusbean

Again, let me set the record straight and make it perfectly clear for you.

I did NOT say “Dr. Peter Crouch (not Geoffrey) said increased blood flow caused by red light could be harmful to rosacea skin”, I was quoting in reply, with the use of italics.

Just for the record, in Geoffrey’s first post in the thread “LLT and LED-induced 1st degree burns and flushing”, he said:

“The LLT and LED mechanism of action is claimed to be "anti-inflammatory". This is the most overused and misunderstood word in the rosacea sufferers vocabulary. In many cases, things that promote dramatic increases in blood flow remove the inflammation…”

In Geoffrey’s first post in the thread “Last Post on Topic & then Rosacea Suffers Make Up Mind”, he said:

“…significantly increase blood flow by 400% to 600%. Here are the facts from a Bio-physics site on the "benefits" of both these machines…”

and then copied in material that was written solely about the effect of LASER light on the skin! Obviously, one must draw a very different conclusion from that!

I have no doubt that Dr Crouch is a busy man and his input on this Forum in relation to his field of expertise - laser treatments for Rosacea - is appreciated.

Your numerous presumptions about me are incorrect, but I shan't rebut them here. If you wish to take personal issue with me, please PM or e-mail me.

Thank you

Jenny

[MARPUSBEAN]

Yes I understand, but it was not totally clear as the warnings from Nase and Crouch seemed to be tied closely together at the time, both of them appeared to say the same thing, except of course Geoffrey, as usual, went over the top and started attacking everything that moved!
Please accept my apology for my misunderstanding, because I thought the original thread was from Crouch.
I prefer to say this publicly, as I am not a fan of PM's, because as you know there has been many problems in the past caused by bitter and angry PM,s which we have seen referred to in public posts, but have had no idea of the contents, I shall continue to keep it open and public.

[Millie]

Interesting thread - coming up on 2 years of forum planning!

9 MORE DAYS!

[phlika29]

Millie

In the spirit of christmas peace and goodwill I am going to lock this thread.

Sarah